This tool says "Xcode replacement" and "Xcode-free development". I thought there is no way they can build apps without Xcode. How would they replicate the libraries, compilers, etc.
I dug more and of course they don't: "Though we don’t rely on the Xcode build system, you still need to install Xcode for the iOS SDK and toolchain"
I think they should clarify their messaging. This is not a replacement or an alternative. It's a layer on top designed for what they think is a better experience.
rockbruno 5 hours ago [-]
I think you are mixing some different concepts here. It's not that this is a layer on top of Xcode/xcodebuild, it's just that Apple today happens to package everything iOS/Swift-related together with Xcode releases. So even if you couldn't care less about the Xcode IDE itself or the xcodebuild build system, you still need to have it because this is the only way for you to download / install those toolchains. Apple could provide these separately, but they just don't.
AppCode
A smart IDE for iOS/macOS development
AppCode is no longer available as a commercial product as of December 14, 2022.
https://www.jetbrains.com/objc/
lwouis 5 hours ago [-]
It seems that Fleet will support building XCode apps. It looks like a big regression from AppCode. As of today Fleet doesn't compile my macOS app. I try regularly on new updates. No alternatives, unfortunately
Larrikin 2 hours ago [-]
Fleet will also most likely get abandoned as people who pay for an IDE highly prefer the older one and people who want VSCode use VSCode
I also think any revival of AppCode is also dead as JetBrains is all in on Kotlin everywhere. iOS multiplatform support hit stable recently.
Would this theoretically allow a Flutter app developer to build and deploy an ios app from Linux? God, I hope so.
candiddevmike 10 hours ago [-]
It technically violates the Apple Developer Agreement AFAIK, but that seems like yet another lawsuit waiting to happen IMO.
ronsor 9 hours ago [-]
Apple won't do anything right now as they're certainly afraid the courts* will slap them hard.
*Both US and EU now
saagarjha 8 hours ago [-]
They’re still rejecting Fortnite so I don’t think they’re particularly scared of anything
jchw 6 hours ago [-]
Epic Games sure is proving to be a formidable opponent, but they might be getting a little optimistic with thinking that Fortnite will be allowed to return to the App Store; after all, while they have been squabbling over App Store policies, I don't think any of the rulings imply that Apple still can't keep specific titles banned from the App Store at their discretion. In that particular case I kinda feel like Apple might be right to not be afraid, at least not right now.
(P.S.: Personally, I initially thought Epic Games was stupid for flagrantly violating the ToS on purpose. Was that really needed to actually file the lawsuit? I dunno; I'm no expert. But it looked stupid. It looks a lot less stupid now, but it still kinda looks like a tactical mistake.)
Maybe they needn't be afraid here either, but from a risk perspective it does seem like causing a stink here may not be their best move. They're still going to aggressively try to railroad people into developing on Mac; there's no iPhone Simulator on Windows or Linux after all.
yard2010 6 hours ago [-]
IMHO it's a matter of principle, showing the bully he has limited power no matter how big his muscles are.
petabyt 8 hours ago [-]
People have been doing hackintoshes and macos VMs for years... And apple hasn't really done anything. So I doubt this tool will provoke them.
karlgkk 5 hours ago [-]
A long while ago, they put some company selling hackintoshes straight into the ground. Nobody tried since
conception 8 hours ago [-]
Apple has killed the Hackintosh…. It’s just bleeding out still.
ofrzeta 7 hours ago [-]
How so? Seems like Hackintosh got kind of obsolete with Apple Silicon.
cyberax 5 hours ago [-]
You can't install XCode on non-Apple devices. Or use iMessage.
zImPatrick 14 minutes ago [-]
you can still install xcode - and also still use imessage if you configure your vm correctly, see kholia/OSX-KVM
johnisgood 3 hours ago [-]
Is this the case? How does that work? Genuinely curious. I remember I had macOS (Mac OS X, actually) on my PC. My last Hackintosh was Mac OS X Leopard. Everything seemed to work well... back then. I even had XCode working.
nar001 3 hours ago [-]
Does it? You still need to install Xcode for the iOS SDK, so they're not really doing anything wrong?
tgma 9 hours ago [-]
IIRC it is only a potential issue if the host machine isn't made by Apple. You can install Linux on a Mac and use this.
IANAL yada yada.
_blk 9 hours ago [-]
Yeah weird world. When Gates bundles IE that no one wants it's an abuse of power but when Jobs shoves his apples down your throat just to (try to) publish for their platform it's all OK.. Oh, or was that the lawsuit waiting to happen? ;)
freeamz 9 hours ago [-]
Same thing with the bank bail out, if Bush did oh my we will never hear end of it, but if cool president who smokes weed and get down some good music, then no one really call him out on it.
gman83 4 hours ago [-]
Just use something like CodeMagic, I wouldn't risk getting your Apple account banned.
Cloudef 9 hours ago [-]
Afaik its already possible with darling. Nixpkgs also has xcbuild replacement, but not sure if it can handle codesigning.
I dug more and of course they don't: "Though we don’t rely on the Xcode build system, you still need to install Xcode for the iOS SDK and toolchain"
I think they should clarify their messaging. This is not a replacement or an alternative. It's a layer on top designed for what they think is a better experience.
I also think any revival of AppCode is also dead as JetBrains is all in on Kotlin everywhere. iOS multiplatform support hit stable recently.
*Both US and EU now
(P.S.: Personally, I initially thought Epic Games was stupid for flagrantly violating the ToS on purpose. Was that really needed to actually file the lawsuit? I dunno; I'm no expert. But it looked stupid. It looks a lot less stupid now, but it still kinda looks like a tactical mistake.)
Maybe they needn't be afraid here either, but from a risk perspective it does seem like causing a stink here may not be their best move. They're still going to aggressively try to railroad people into developing on Mac; there's no iPhone Simulator on Windows or Linux after all.
IANAL yada yada.
If for no other reason, it would be gloriously ironic.
I thought it was for compilation of ios apps for linux and macos.