> [this individual] will help strengthen the genetic diversity of the Asian elephant population in North America and around the world.
I'm happy for them that there is now a calf after a long time, but this sentence doesn't read as hopeful as the author probably intended
assimpleaspossi 70 days ago [-]
There have been seven Asian elephants born at the St Louis Zoo since 1992.
eleveriven 70 days ago [-]
The key difference is that births like those (and this one) aren't about "we need more elephants," they're about which elephants survive and reproduce
assimpleaspossi 70 days ago [-]
Well, "[Raja] was the first elephant ever born at the Saint Louis Zoo and is considered a St. Louis legend. Male Asian elephant Raja, born amid fanfare nearly 31 years ago on Dec. 27, 1992, has three daughters at the Zoo..."
I do appreciate that they're explicit about why this matters (genetic diversity, SSP, long-term conservation work) instead of just treating it as zoo PR
vscode-rest 70 days ago [-]
Everything you listed is zoo PR, just for a different target audience.
(that doesn’t make it bad)
uxhacker 70 days ago [-]
So there are now 55000 and 1 Asian elephants*. I don’t understand the newsworthiness of having an extra Asian elephant joining the other 15000 Asian elephants in captivity.
Wild Asian elephants roam between 100km2 to 1500km2. This elephant will spend a life confined to just how many square km’s?
assaddayinh 70 days ago [-]
The conquest for utopian perfection is the enemy of all good things. In the wild she would be poached, hunted and ground dow into medieval medicine, while contained to ever more little islands of wild.
Please god free us from those who want to burn the bakery, because they think tomorrow it will rain manna from the heavens. No curse us greater then a rampant idealist, unwilling to sense reality.
PS: Why not have pragmatic solutions where there are elephant days where the herd to roam in a park?
riedel 70 days ago [-]
While I totally agree, the underlying conflict is that Zoos over use the argument of preservation these days. On the other end they certainly have the need to stay entertainment venues, a conflict which they seldomly address.
Recently there was a obviously necessary mass culling of baboons in the Nuremberg zoo which shows some of the controversy [1]
They could have hunting preserves, basically areas sharedby predators and prey similar to nature as enrichment, but that would be cruelty for the cityZens.
Im argueing against nature preserves in poorer countries, where western nations deluded citizens pay to keep a piece of nature which are basically mirages of "intactness" in economic good times, vanishing from the earth entirely in economic bad times. Which the very same proponents usually argue for with degrowth arguments.
cultofmetatron 70 days ago [-]
zoos and aquariums serve a very vital purpose. most people only care about these animals because they can go SEE them alive. documentaries help but nothing beats getting a captive people into a room to see a wild animal and then bamboozling them with propaganda about how important it is to preserve these animals. Its the reason we have funding to keep these creatures alive in the wild at all.
if all zoos and aquariums were shut down, public concern about the environment would slowly drift to nothing within 2 generations.
eleveriven 70 days ago [-]
At the same time, I think it's risky to lean too hard on the idea that captivity is the only way to sustain concern
throaway54 69 days ago [-]
It isn't, but its often been the only reason that a species didn't go extinct.
Imustaskforhelp 69 days ago [-]
Pandas being one of those species. I feel as if pandas would go extinct if zoos weren't there.
technically panda's cuteness is the reason why it hasn't really gotten extinct. Dogs/Cats have also mastered the cuteness stat. I wonder if for animals, evolution might now lean towards cuteness.
I am also thinking what counts as cute in the first place? Is there any scientific consensus around cuteness that animals can develop?
eleveriven 70 days ago [-]
Yet framing it as either captivity or guaranteed death is also a bit of a false binary. Zoos are a mitigation strategy, not a moral end state
uxhacker 70 days ago [-]
So it will cost at least 100,000 usd to keep this poor elephant confined in a zoo in the US versus about 15,000 in a wild sanctuary in Thailand.
In the wild sanctuary it will have space to roam.
dyauspitr 70 days ago [-]
To be fair, elephant hunting and poaching in India over the last 20 odd years is negligible. I believe it accounts for less than 1% of elephant deaths since 2010.
eleveriven 70 days ago [-]
Zoos are a tradeoff: constrained lives in exchange for research, genetic insurance... And whether that tradeoff is worth it depends entirely on whether the off-site work actually helps wild populations
mikkupikku 70 days ago [-]
Every single elephant is precious.
kelipso 70 days ago [-]
Whenever someone mentions Asian elephants in American zoos, I remember my visit to Columbus zoo, where they treated the Asian elephants like African elephants. Very dry environment, very little water, feeding them dry hay, just absolutely atrocious treatment.
downboots 70 days ago [-]
At last someone addresses it
tantalor 70 days ago [-]
Ssshhh we don't talk about it
usagisushi 70 days ago [-]
There is room for the elephant.
dennis_jeeves2 70 days ago [-]
There room in the elephant.
Rendered at 07:04:15 GMT+0000 (UTC) with Wasmer Edge.
https://nationalzoo.si.edu/news/female-asian-elephant-calf-b...
And even more pictures and info on Asian elephants:
https://nationalzoo.si.edu/animals/news/get-know-herd-asian-...
I'm happy for them that there is now a calf after a long time, but this sentence doesn't read as hopeful as the author probably intended
https://stlzoo.org/news/elephant-news
(that doesn’t make it bad)
Wild Asian elephants roam between 100km2 to 1500km2. This elephant will spend a life confined to just how many square km’s?
Please god free us from those who want to burn the bakery, because they think tomorrow it will rain manna from the heavens. No curse us greater then a rampant idealist, unwilling to sense reality.
PS: Why not have pragmatic solutions where there are elephant days where the herd to roam in a park?
Recently there was a obviously necessary mass culling of baboons in the Nuremberg zoo which shows some of the controversy [1]
[1] https://www.greenmemag.com/animals/the-nuremberg-zoo-controv...
Im argueing against nature preserves in poorer countries, where western nations deluded citizens pay to keep a piece of nature which are basically mirages of "intactness" in economic good times, vanishing from the earth entirely in economic bad times. Which the very same proponents usually argue for with degrowth arguments.
if all zoos and aquariums were shut down, public concern about the environment would slowly drift to nothing within 2 generations.
technically panda's cuteness is the reason why it hasn't really gotten extinct. Dogs/Cats have also mastered the cuteness stat. I wonder if for animals, evolution might now lean towards cuteness.
I am also thinking what counts as cute in the first place? Is there any scientific consensus around cuteness that animals can develop?
In the wild sanctuary it will have space to roam.